Media Man Under ScrutinyWest Australian Racing

Aquanita

Innocent until proven guilty but not a good look.

http://www.racingnsw.com.au/default.aspx?s=article-display&id=18467

Aquanita

Sorry should have been under National Racing

paraletic

Mmmmmm, so a thirsty traveller cant cop a tip anymore? What would happen if he did tip it in his selections?

Dale

would like to have a look at ritchie callendars text messages then.

paraletic

furthermore, what would have happened if it lost??!! Probably nothing. If you get a tip and it wins run for cover, you will be exposed!!!!! **** idiots.

Aquanita

Probably informing Camillieri after the race that he left it out if his tips after backing it was not a smart thing to do.

Aquanita

paraletic said:

furthermore, what would have happened if it lost??!! Probably nothing. If you get a tip and it wins run for cover, you will be exposed!!!!! **** idiots.

You are aware that the horse returned a positive swab after receiving treatment arranged by Camillieri.

paraletic

yes im aware of that, but you cant get a tip anymore?

Be interested to see what Camillieri's text said to BZ.... If it is just a case of "get on" how was BZ to know it had been juiced?

they need transcripts of the text messages before throwing him under the bus imho.

bookielover

Zarrafa's an idiot.

Fancy doing that.

He knows that some of the mugs at home look to him for a tip and he knows that if he tips the horse, the blokes who follow him will back it, and cause the tote odds, at the very least, to shorten.

the fact that he was involved with Camelleri is a black mark against him.

He's in trouble and this will probably cost him his job on Sky and possibly the Daily Telegraph.

Although this is a different example and relates to an era gone by, I'm reminded of a story told to me by a pro punter.

Way back when, double pools on the trots at various Country tracks in Victoria were pretty big, reaching $150,000 in the early 70's when a nice home was $20,000.

Bill Larty now deceased, who was the caller at Terang trots, used to be paid $2.00, that's right, $2.00 to tip certain horses in his daily double selections.

The punter told me, that he and and few other pros had a contact at the TAB at the time who revealed to them that up to 60% of the double pool was taken on Larty's selections.

So they paid him to tip horses that would steer punters to the horses that the pros were not going to take in the Daily Double, thereby ensuring a much bigger dividend when the pros selections came home.

Larty used to get $5.00 a night to call. The average wage for some workers was $30.00 a week and two bucks bought you a fair bit of food.

In some strange way, it seems that the more things change, the more they stay the same.

DarkTarget

He wasn't aware the horse was juiced though was he?

The only one he needs to answer to IMO is his employer for misleading the public on his thoughts. I cant see how tipping one thing and backing another has anything to do with Racing NSW (and I think the powers that be here in Aus are a joke for the way they treat punters),.

Aquanita

We will have to wait for the evidence to unfold in its entirety but essentially what Paraletic and Dark Target are saying it is is not detrimental to the image of racing if a paid media personality backs a horse in a race and then leaves it out of his tips to the general public.

Different set of morals on display here.

DarkTarget

No i'm not saying that at all Aquanita, what i'm saying is, Racing NSW should have absolutely ZERO influence on how people go about their business in their jobs in the industry.

If a journalist wants to write an article detailing just how rooted the product has become here then they should be able to do as they please, not be gagged (or attempted to be gagged like they do) to protect their image.

bookielover

Normally I'd agree with you DT..
I once walked off the track with my old man and the late Rollo Roylance who was the head writer for the Sporting Globe.

He'd appeared on radio and given his tips for a meeting at Caulfield. My old man recalled that he'd tipped 6 out of the 8 winners including a 10/1 chance and the 33/1 winner of the last.

"You would have had a big day today," said my dad to Rollo. "You're joking aren't you" replied Rollo. "I don't back my tips. I wait till I get to the track and follow the money, and today your mob cleaned up, and I'm going home cast."

The fact is, that Rollo wasn't an orphan at doing that among the tipsters. My dad recalled the great racing writer Bert Wolfe who wrote under the pen name of Cardigan, never backed his own tips but had a huge following among the general public.

Where Zarrafa is stuffed, in my opinion, is that he's been in contact with one of the alleged prime ring leaders, for want of a better term.

If not for his involvement with this bloke, no one would give it a second thought, and he certainly would not have been brought into this scandal.

I'm certainly not alleging any wrongdoing on his behalf when I say this, but the fact that Peter Sequenzia has had his name brought into this, is enough for me.

bookielover

I should qualify that last sentence by saying that his name is not linked to Zerrafa's just the inquiry against Sam Kavanagh in general.

paraletic

Aquanita said:

We will have to wait for the evidence to unfold in its entirety but essentially what Paraletic and Dark Target are saying it is is not detrimental to the image of racing if a paid media personality backs a horse in a race and then leaves it out of his tips to the general public.

Different set of morals on display here.

It happens all day everyday Aquanita. And that is a fact......

Aquanita

I don't disagree with that statement but does it make it right?

tony

Also interesting is that this happened when he was working for a previous employer.

hash

race callers and media personnel all have close ties with certain stables and trainers, you'd have either be very naïve to think they don't get mail when a horse is ready to win and tip others publically to protect a price! even The Penguin knows how this system works

bookielover

Sorry gents. But I really can't understand your stance on this, Paraletic and DT.

If Zarrafa had tipped number 3 and then backed number 8, we would never have known about it, nor is it anyone's, including the NSW Stewards business.

But that's not what happened here.

Just read the last 3 paragraphs again, and if you can't conclude from that, that Zarrafa might have a case to answer, then frankly, I reckon you haven't comprehended the events that have taken place here.

bookielover

He's been stood down by Sky on full pay pending the outcome of the investigation.

I'm happy he's being paid.

As Aquanita said innocent until proven guilty.

DarkTarget

The gist of it from what I can gather is this - he's backed a horse his mate told him to that he didn't put in his selections so as not to ruin his price?

He has a case to answer for from his employer for not carrying out his duties properly, but where does Racing NSW fit into all of this, he has nothing to do with Racing NSW?

hash

plenty of issues here but I think the main one is the camp the horse came from, Sam Kav is the most mentioned trainer at the moment with the cobalt, caffeine and all the other gear been administered in his runners

any other trainer and I don't think BZ would have been treated as harshly or the story so pumped up

darkshines

Am i reading it wrongly - I just assumed the wording implied that Zerafa knew WHY the horse was being tipped - i.e. had his vitamins

paraletic

BL we are miles apart in our views here. I just cant fathom that the poor bloke is being hung out to dry for copping a tip, betting on it and winning. If it loses would anyone be making a issue of it, highly unlikely. These tip givers that work in the media get given the "word" day in day out, doesnt mean they will always win or in their expert opinion look like a winning chance, hence it may be left out of their selections. However they may in fact back it themselves. There is nothing wrong with this imo. did he intentionally leave it out to protect the price, well only he can answer that. Did the sms say "Brent, back such and such its juiced".... I doubt it. If it did then there is a case to answer. If we/they are going to be petty about it then ALL media personal should have betting records looked at on a regular basis and cross referenced to their tips. Richie Calender would be shitting himself.

tony

darkshines said:

Am i reading it wrongly - I just assumed the wording implied that Zerafa knew WHY the horse was being tipped - i.e. had his vitamins

Exactly. The fact that the "tip" came from John Camilleri tells you that this is a strong possibility.

Aquanita

A quote from the evidence Camilleri gave to the Sam Kavanagh inquiry on August 5th.

Not saying it was Zerafa and the inquiry will answer that question.

"After Palazzo Pubblico won at Randwick on January 17, Camilleri sent a text to a media personality saying: "Those galloping Cs have to wake up a week before to outsmart us trotting grubs"."

AndrewCarter

I can speak from personal experience, as far as I'm concerned when you're doing a job like that you are being paid to tip to the best of your ability and you tip accordingly, not everyone subscribes to that theory but that's the way I believe that you're obligated to act.

I've acted in that manner from the word go, when I was cadet at Trotwest we had to do our tips on the Tuesday night virtually as the final fields came out for Friday's GP or RR due to the print deadline the following morning and we also had to tip for the country meeting on Saturday night at the same time. Despite that I still won the media tipping while working there including most winners on a program and the longest priced winner on a Friday night and if the price was right and I was betting in the race I would invariably back my tips.

If you are associated with various people you can't necessarily divulge specific information that you may have been told in confidence but you do have an obligation to allude towards a favourable summation of that horses chance if they're favourable through your own form and analysis, particularly if you already fancy that particular horse without betraying the trust of those involved.

If I strongly fancy something in my tipping unless the price then comes up below what I believe it should be and I would then point out that I believe such and such will be very hard to beat and should win but I don't think its any value at this price or is under the odds etc then I invariably back the horse I am tipping strongly if I'm betting in the race or alternatively if something is big value I emphasise that I really like this horse and state that it's tremendous value at this price.

bookielover

Paraletic, commentators on track cop tips all the time. Nothing unusual in that.

And as I pointed out, nothing wrong in a tipster tipping horse A but backing horse B.

New South Wales Stewards, operate totally independently from Racing new South Wales.

What the Stewards who are inquiring into Sam Kavanagh's stable and his associate, Camalleri, are asking, is pretty clear.

Read the wording carefully.

....Stewards HAVE IDENTIFIED text communications BEFORE RACE 3 between Mr. Brent Zarrafa and Mr. John Camilleri in relation to Mr. Camilleri's involvement with the stable of Mr. Sam Kavanagh and INCLUDING A TIP FROM Mr. Camilleri for Pallazo Publico to win race 3.

The issue is not that Brent copped a tip per se.

It is not illegal to cop a tip from a trainer, or in this case, a mate with an involvement in a stable. A jockey yes. Although they now basically tip to the public every time they give an interview prior to a race.

The obvious questions just from that paragraph are, what are the contents of the text communications, and furthermore, what do the Stewards then mean by texts between Zarrafa and Camelliri, in relation to Camelliri's involvement with Kavanagh's stable.

The Stewards then point out that Brent texted that he hadn't tipped the horse.

What the Stewards are basically asking is, what did Brent know, how much did he know, and when did he know it. What info was he getting from Camalleri who has admitted that he drenched horses with the Cobalt.

Did Brent have prior knowledge of the drenching.

All this stuff will eventually come out in the inquiry.

If Brent was an innocent party to all this and had no prior knowledge or any knowledge at all that Kavanagh was allegedly cheating and utilizing Camalleri's assistance to do so, then he's got nothing to worry about.

On face value, it's not a good look.

But, innocent until proven otherwise.

runyon

I suppose it's a bit like a stock analyst who writes a column in the business pages and recommends you buy a couple of stocks that he knows are probably about to become worthless while he has inside information on one that is probably about to go through the roof and he buys that one himself.
Morally it's wrong (maybe even legally for the stock analyst depending how he got his info) but if you're dumb enough to listen to either of them you probably deserve what you get.

spinking

about ten years ago I think it was roughly around there had a horse having its first start when they didn't race at ascot over the summer for whatever reason it was so on the Saturday morning I think it was lenton or maybe severn cant really remember who did the tipping and prices for the day he did not even mention my horse in his first 4 tips horse ran third beaten narrowly next start same bloke same station declared the dogs were barking loudly about this last start we were all on personally didn't see anything wrong in it apart from the fact he most probably character assanated himself to some point

colin

I think everyone is missing the point.

" Despite that I still won the media tipping while working there including most winners on a program and the longest priced winner on a Friday night."

It's obviously not about Brett Z or Sam K. It's about Andrew C.

Alert the authorities.