Comments worth a post but not a thread of their ownHarness & Greyhounds

KTQ

What a recovery by Lewis. Lucky he's light and fit & can breakdance himself back into the seat. Would have loved to see him finish the race but alas, Bonsu was retired. 

http://www.harness.org.au/racing/fields/race-fields/?mc=PA041217

(Does something similar to this thread exist? Am I recreating the wheel)

Fastmoney

Ridersonthestorm33

^^Brilliant, great understanding between driver and horse...frame by frame composure of both.

She's a showoff that girl..right on herself haha..'cmon Mr. Lewis I'm waiting' , final frame away and pacing with the unique neat style of hers, head up and proud as punch, busted tyre and all!

She hasn't got much of a motor but plenty of heart which is a motor within itself.

Ridersonthestorm33

As soon as she got pacing again..the head went back down and it was all business. If ever a horse enjoys it immensely out on the track it's her.

Her debut run was Saturday 5th March 2011 Gloucester Park . Driver Colin Brown. 4th placing. Winner Money Never Sleeps.

First win Monday December 17th 2012. Pinjarra. Driver - Chris Lewis.

Markovina

Its a good thread title ( for general stuff )

But on a few spills - about 9mths ago - i think at Charlton a Sunday meeting - Glen Douglas drive broke in the final straight - got all tangled up - got dilodged in the air - and he  ended up in Mick Bellmans sulky  when they crossed the line - when something like that happens - you just gravitate - or cling onto whatever you can

Worse one i ever saw was John McClean - im pretty sure the horse was Sammy Karamea - at Harold Park - was in the death - horse blundered and fell - honestly got hit by the entire field - women with prams and young kids were screaming with horror - thats how bad it was . However McClean - a tall leanish sort of bloke - just got up - dusted off his pants - undid his little skull cap - - hurled it into the ground - picked it up and walked off unscathed

loose_goose

Found this http://www.harness.org.au/media-room/news-article/?news_id=32713 ;

Markovina

loose_goose said:

Found this http://www.harness.org.au/media-room/news-article/?news_id=32713 ;

Thats the one at Charlton i think - but your link when i clicked it didnt work

Honestly Glen Douglass should be in the Olympics after that effort

KTQ

Both of them did well to stay in. Look at the guy in the red, he's hanging out too.

loose_goose

try again http://www.harness.org.au/media-room/news-article/?news_id=32713

KTQ

I found barrier and win information on the Tracks page on harness.org.au and put them into a chart to compare track to track. Not much to say on it at this stage, but interesting to see Golden Mile's most winningest barrier is 6 followed by 9, Wagin's is 4 followed by 10. Could it be due to PBD? Guess I'll never know.

loose_goose

KTQ said:

I found barrier and win information on the Tracks page on harness.org.au and put them into a chart to compare track to track. Not much to say on it at this stage, but interesting to see Golden Mile's most winningest barrier is 6 followed by 9, Wagin's is 4 followed by 10. Could it be due to PBD? Guess I'll never know.

And Albany barrier 6 too, would never have thought that at any track

KTQ

I thought there might be something to say about track size, distance or sprint lane but it'd involve a lot more digging and research. In my opinion, that info should be easy to find but it's not. Stats make the sports world go round. Guys (and girls) with friends talking stats about baseball, NFL, NHL.. batting averages, pitching speeds, yards run, shut outs. Harness could create so much excitement and interest if only they'd provide us with stats to create that conversation

Markovina

That 1st race at Melton today ( there calling it Geel @Melton  -its the washed out Metro meeting from Thursday night - so metro horses )

That type of race - with horses coming from 2nd last and last ( and bear in mind it was the sprint trip as well !!!)  is the type of racing you would love to see at GP - Bunbury and Pinjarra - but sadly you dont

Melton is a 1st class track - not a screaming biased leaders track  - it has got a sprint lane - so it covers all options - however you get a great end product when you have a 1st class facility

JayJay

I hear your argument on leaders bias at GP Marko....a product of lots of things, PBD amongst them and if the best horse leads, then yes, a screaming leaders track, like most tracks when the best horse leads.
However, in the name of balance, an analysis of Friday Night at GP reveals the following (and yes, one example is a restricted data set) but these are the facts:
Race 1 Aussie Delight....came from 4th (1x1) to beat Khun Ratha and Livura who both came from way back in the field. Leader got beat.
Race 2 Skippy Rascal ...came from 1x1 to beat leader simba Bromac with Wrappers Delight coming from way back. Leader got beat.
Race 3 Leader won
Race 4 Ideal Alice from 5th at the bell (3 back the pegs) beats the breeze horse Almaretto with Quite a Delight 3rd from way back. Leader (and a good leader in Eden Franco) got beat.
Race 5 Courage Tells ...from 4 back the pegs at the bell...leader got beat.
Race 6 Well yes, Lazarus wins from leaders back horse Chicago and leader Tiger Tara but they were the best 3 in the race and the way the draw panned out, that was the expected result.
Race 7 Ultimate Machete..as above the draw said he will win, way too classy.
Race 8 The Bucket List works around 3 wide, leader gets beat, Major Dan 3rd from way back.
Race 9 Mista Shark circles around them 3 wide. Leader got beat.
Race 10 Trotters race...say no more, they are a raffle on a good night.
Race 11 Costa del Magnifico ...around them 3 wide...leader got beat.

Not at all wishing to start an argument but was hardly a screaming leaders track last Friday, that's all.

KTQ

Does anyone have any suggestions on where we can advertise for stablehands/track work staff, or know of anyone looking for a job? I've tried the job board on harness.org.au, Twitter, messaged the South Regional TAFE, put it on the WA Harness Trader and Australia Harness trader Facebook groups plus a couple other job sites.. not sure where else would work.

Job is based in Busselton, pays well, we've got no shortage of high quality horses plus because we only train ones we own, there's no issues with job security. Ai ai ai ai ai. Why is it so hard to find people.

curmudgeon

Sat night numbers

1.     1-5-8-7

2.     2-1-6-4

3.     1-3-2-10 (SR 1)

4.     1-9-2-7

5.     10 (SR 1)- 11 (SR 2) - 1- 2

6.      2-1-6-7

7.      7 - 10(SR 1) - 12 (SR 3 ) - 11 (SR2)

8       4 - 10 (SR-1) -12(SR3)- 6

9    Standing Start -  12 (40m) - 2 (10m)- 5 (10m) -8 (20m)

These numbers reflect the flat out advantage that inside horses have in the RBD's at GP.

Drawn 3 to 9 and 90% are only looking to run a place from the start .... hoping someone is going to have a brain fade and attack the leader unmercifully to give them any chance of winning by turning the race upside down to contemplate with their QDT.

There are too many horses on the track for it to be anything approaching even contests and the PBD conditions do nothing to alleviate this. Races such as M0-2 RBD  & MO $14990heat/ $25000 final RBD races are very ordinary handicapping events. The best horses/tightest assessed horses often draw inside lesser assessed horses and start odds on from better draws.

Even more ridiculous have been MO heat / final series where the heats are pref draw on C Class and the final RBD ie a C15 can draw inside a C1 in the final. Mind boggling.

KTQ

but why are C1's entering for M0 races? When I was a kid, you generally wouldn't enter for GP on a Friday unless you'd won 4 country races from memory.

curmudgeon

Because at GP C1's can be competitive against C8's if they are drawn inside.....such is the pegs advantage. Also C1's are not always genuine C1's ie they may have been C4's who have dropped back after a series of losses

JayJay

Yep, old "qualifying stakes" was for 2.25 or better which equates to C3....agree the RBD of The San Simeon Final makes for a potential no contest.

KTQ

Well then really, that's the trainer's fault - not the handicappers.

And I'm not sure that's how handicapping works in WA. I'm 95% sure you cant drop to a C4 to a C1 based on a losing sequence. Mares can drop a class against the boys, and juniors can drop a class. Barriers can be based on prizemoney past 6 etc.. but I'm pretty sure you can't just drop classes because you haven't won in a while

curmudgeon

Every 10 starts without success you drop a class......if you are a C10 and race 90 times without winning you will become a C1.

The secret is in the understanding of the word "handicapper"......in the races I mentioned and others not mentioned the office responsible applies conditions that can "advantage" better class horses to the detriment of lesser assessed horses. That is not what handicappers should aspire to do.

Markovina

Aah - i was wondering how that worked

Id see a horse in a NSW Riverina meeting - and it would be in a C1 - the old Beginners /Improvers - and might have a record of 100  starts for 7 wins and 12 placings - and it would be opposed to horses who have won 1 race max

KTQ

I have never seen that in WA... can you find a field in WA where that's the case? I'm really curious now!

(exception being a horse that won races as a 2/3 year old, where their wins don't contribute to C class unless they've raced in C class races)

Moonraker

The mixing of claimers into graded races is also more prevalent in NSW.

ie there might be a race for C1's and claimers with price between $2,000-$4,000 

curmudgeon

There are a number of runners in races at Pinjarra today that have dropped back multiple classes over time due to lack of victory in races. eg race 5 Barkers Hall  for instance is a 14 race winning C2. Lisdelight is a 6 race winning C1 Ergo is a 9 race winning C1 Ronan Maguire an 11 race winning C2 etc etc.

curmudgeon

Markovina said:

Aah - i was wondering how that worked

Id see a horse in a NSW Riverina meeting - and it would be in a C1 - the old Beginners /Improvers - and might have a record of 100  starts for 7 wins and 12 placings - and it would be opposed to horses who have won 1 race max

The drop back rule is a national application Marko. It was meant as an incentive to keep older horses who were no longer competitive at their assessment racing rather than being turned out or otherwise. To keep field sizes at an optimum size it has been somewhat successful but due to the nature of the durable old standardbred younger horses have to compete against some pretty decent older horses that have dropped back so it is a double edged sword.

VillageKid

Melton a 1st class track? 

Only behind Menangle as the most boring main track in Australia for mine.

Give me GP every day of the week!

Ridersonthestorm33

Globe Derby 17kms from Adelaide CBD.

Melton 50kms from Melbourne CBD , no public transport in the evening.

Menangle just a lazy 70kms from the Sydney CBD, hitchhiking only.

savethegame

KTQ said:

I have never seen that in WA... can you find a field in WA where that's the case? I'm really curious now!

(exception being a horse that won races as a 2/3 year old, where their wins don't contribute to C class unless they've raced in C class races)

the perfect example with  a  family that have  harness involvement on a daily basis for 45years I no of,would not surprise me if its over fifty years .....total dedication and love for the standardbred ..

tonight at Narrogin hilo rex back to c2  his stats 165 starts 17wins 11 seconds 21 thirds 98k stakemoney his won 7  in 2012;;;; 4 in 2013 ;;;;;2 in 2014;;;;;2 in 2015 1 in 2016 1 in 2017 so far

the family breed  the horse they full well no his capabilities as a 9 year old and they would thoroughly enjoy getting up to work him....would like to no over the journey how many winners w.t.groves has trained over 400?

great to see some of the conditions attached to races to get fair dinkum about stopping the exodus of trainers the co tonight is for horses that haven't won a stake greater than 3,500 in there last ten starts random b.draw..alta christano couldn't have won this one....100 unplaced money should be 2  now to program a race for participants  that haven't won a race in twelve months with a common sense approach to conditions.. its called savethegame  

good card of country harness tonight..

JayJay

Yes STG, Alta Christiano or Beaudienne couldn't start ....but they could front up in the C2 after having won the Derby......and the R race for $3500,   win and you get $1755 after percentages.....after travel, a coffee and a burger for the family and your lucky to clear $1500 ......hardly a huge incentive.
It is a good old fashioned country meet.....but aside from a few keen connections and family, it won't be busy in the dining room. Hope I'm wrong....and hope after traveling over, that the forecast "possible storm" doesn't eventuate.

curmudgeon

Narrogin is in the Bermuda triangle of harness racing.......more meetings have been lost without trace there in "possible storms" than anywhere on the globe. Poor buggers seem to cop it regularly.