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warrenrobinsonwarrenrobinson    274 posts
Harness & Greyhounds
Morning, Hearing a few syndication members are not happy with the management of Trotsynd, not sure of the legalities of running syndicates re yearly reporting audit, ACC but certainly worth a discussion.
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Comments

  • JayJayJayJay    8,086 posts
    Manning was a good Trotsynd horse.
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  • JayJayJayJay    8,086 posts
    Manning 74 starts, 15 wins, 14 placings from 74 starts and $225k in stake earnings.

    Depending on what the initial buy in figure was, there should be many very happy shareholders.
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  • warrenrobinsonwarrenrobinson    274 posts
    Good horse Manning but with every income comes a cost now that would be interesting.
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  • Rocket_ReignRocket_Reign    904 posts
    Maybe you should elaborate some more Warren, not sure what conspiracy theory you’re getting at. Unbelievably some horses/trainers do make profit for their owners understandable you couldn’t grasp the concept

    Cant_Refuse likes this post.

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  • JayJayJayJay    8,086 posts
    Manning also earned significant Westbred Bonuses as a 2 and 3 year old, around about $15k it seems, so total stake earnings around $240k. He cost $19k as a yearling plus GST. Take off the 12.5% trainer/driver percentages of around $20k, so net earnings around $200k.

    He was Trotsynd No 16 and I don't know what the 5% shares sold for that included 12 months breaking training etc inclusive.

    After that, the question is did his earn cover his training costs for the next 4 or so years after the "free period" expired. I note he is now retired and de-registered, presumably to a nice home. Syndicate shareholders would know from their statements/accounts, and deposits into their accounts, whether they won, lost or broke even on their investment.

    Cant_Refuse likes this post.

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  • savethegamesavethegame    2,973 posts
    There was owner of Manning that wasn;t to happy  when he was odds on fav, in sales classic race and driver handed up to stablemate in final, Voiced his displeasure on here. 
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  • JayJayJayJay    8,086 posts
    No free Martini's that night in the Winners Bar, although realistically the stable mate was the superior horse in spite of the race callers frenzied barracking for Manning in the run.

    Cant_Refuse, Gilgamesh likes this post.

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  • warrenrobinsonwarrenrobinson    274 posts
    No conspiracy Mick just interested in the facts and yes some horses/trainers do make a profit that's how all business should run.  Being just an old hobbyist having a bit of fun  and pretty lucky to be in a financial position to do what i want you can only hope that you end up like me.
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  • Cant_RefuseCant_Refuse    198 posts
    warrenrobinson said:

    and pretty lucky to be in a financial position to do what i want you can only hope that you end up like me.


    I highly doubt he would want to end up like you…..

    Rocket_Reign likes this post.

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  • warrenrobinsonwarrenrobinson    274 posts
    Financially i meant and haven't had to leech of anyone all my life,
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  • Rocket_ReignRocket_Reign    904 posts
    Cant_Refuse said:

    warrenrobinson said:

    and pretty lucky to be in a financial position to do what i want you can only hope that you end up like me.


    I highly doubt he would want to end up like you…..



    God. Please no
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  • MuldoonMuldoon    433 posts
    JayJay said:

    No free Martini's that night in the Winners Bar, although realistically the stable mate was the superior horse in spite of the race callers frenzied barracking for Manning in the run.

    Link to replay ?
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  • MuldoonMuldoon    433 posts
    warrenrobinson said:

    Financially i meant and haven't had to leech of anyone all my life,

    CR sounds like he would
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  • Chopchop43Chopchop43    309 posts
    What is this a forum about all things harness racing or a pissing contest
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  • warrenrobinsonwarrenrobinson    274 posts
    Now let's get back to Trotsynd, through the freedom of information act i wonder if the figures would be available to the public?
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  • Rocket_ReignRocket_Reign    904 posts
    Warren loves a gossip. Fact

    Cant_Refuse likes this post.

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  • warrenrobinsonwarrenrobinson    274 posts
    Warren doesn't do gossip only facts. No smoke without fire.
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  • JayJayJayJay    8,086 posts
    All licensed syndicators in WA must be registered with RWWA and ASIC, and possess an Australian Financial Services Licence. Trotsynd complies with those requirements.

    Product disclosure statements must be lodged with RWWA and made available to all shareholders for signing. I wouldn't think you would need a FOI application as prospective investors should have access to "bottom line" accounts from previous syndicationsto determine whether they going to proceed, do a risk assessment, make an informed decision etc.

    Clearly, it is a high risk investment and some of the syndicate horses have experienced shocking luck. I believe Valedictorian got bitten by a snake(???), I think Beat The Bank had a leg fracture and some of the others were simply not successful, which we all know can be par for the course.

    Rocket_Reign, Chopchop43, warrenrobinson likes this post.

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  • AbbysAceAbbysAce    647 posts
    I thought Trot synd horses went to different WA trainers , or now do they go the same trainer every year?
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  • JayJayJayJay    8,086 posts
    I think that was the case with Ross Waddell and his WA Pacing or Pacing WA organisation, Tilly had some, Kat Warwick, Sarah Suvaljko and maybe some others. But they combined with Trotsynd some time back.

    Since then, they advertise that their purchases will be trained by "WA's Leading Juvenile Trainer Justin Prentice" which is where they seem to go early days. I think that is the arrangement but stand corrected.

    It seems they move on if not to his standards or if he runs out of room???. Heartofalia (sic) now with Cory Peterson, another one leased out to Michael Blakemore (Dream something?)..... not sure as to how those decisions are made, presumably the syndicate holders get consulted or whatever, vote and make the call.

    Not quite sure about Beat The Bank ....I heard (unconfirmed) that he was given away to a good home after injury and everyone signed out but he is back racing with great success for Phil Duggan, earned about $80k since his comeback, so not sure what the go is there.

    Trotsynd 20 horse Valedictorian was found dead in his paddock, I think snake bite was suspected...he was the "Harness The Dream" 10% share horse that was drawn on one of teh Pacing Cup Nights .

    warrenrobinson likes this post.

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  • JayJayJayJay    8,086 posts
    edited March 2024
    JayJay said:

    Manning also earned significant Westbred Bonuses as a 2 and 3 year old, around about $15k it seems, so total stake earnings around $240k. He cost $19k as a yearling plus GST. Take off the 12.5% trainer/driver percentages of around $20k, so net earnings around $200k.

    He was Trotsynd No 16 and I don't know what the 5% shares sold for that included 12 months breaking training etc inclusive.

    After that, the question is did his earn cover his training costs for the next 4 or so years after the "free period" expired. I note he is now retired and de-registered, presumably to a nice home. Syndicate shareholders would know from their statements/accounts, and deposits into their accounts, whether they won, lost or broke even on their investment.


    Found it...Trotsynd Number 16 shares were $2,800 each for 5% ($56,000) which covered 12 months free training. So after purchase price of $19k plus GST plus Insurance (presumeably), floating expenses (Is there a management fee?) etc etc, around $30k left in the pot to cover breaking, education and racing preps in the first year.
    Picked up $22,800 plus Westbred first win of $3,000 plus bonus of $2,550 for a total of $30k plus inside that 12 months. So hopefully, all shareholders got a very positive early return, especially as he won the $100k Pearl ($64k first place) just 3 months later.

    Gilgamesh likes this post.

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  • MuldoonMuldoon    433 posts
    JayJay said:

    No free Martini's that night in the Winners Bar, although realistically the stable mate was the superior horse in spite of the race callers frenzied barracking for Manning in the run.

    I went searching, this one ? https://www.harness.org.au/racing/fields/race-fields/?mc=GP080319

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  • Rocket_ReignRocket_Reign    904 posts
    JayJay said:

    I think that was the case with Ross Waddell and his WA Pacing or Pacing WA organisation, Tilly had some, Kat Warwick, Sarah Suvaljko and maybe some others. But they combined with Trotsynd some time back.

    Since then, they advertise that their purchases will be trained by "WA's Leading Juvenile Trainer Justin Prentice" which is where they seem to go early days. I think that is the arrangement but stand corrected.

    It seems they move on if not to his standards or if he runs out of room???. Heartofalia (sic) now with Cory Peterson, another one leased out to Michael Blakemore (Dream something?)..... not sure as to how those decisions are made, presumably the syndicate holders get consulted or whatever, vote and make the call.

    Not quite sure about Beat The Bank ....I heard (unconfirmed) that he was given away to a good home after injury and everyone signed out but he is back racing with great success for Phil Duggan, earned about $80k since his comeback, so not sure what the go is there.

    Trotsynd 20 horse Valedictorian was found dead in his paddock, I think snake bite was suspected...he was the "Harness The Dream" 10% share horse that was drawn on one of teh Pacing Cup Nights .



    When I got manning it was put to all the owners first as a vote between a couple of trainers if I recall properly

    JayJay, LightningJake, Gilgamesh likes this post.

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