The wild, wild ... Great Southern ...

ninjadingo · November 10

I've been following this forum for a while and really love the community (and the tips). I never had much to post, just enjoyed browsing the chats and taking in the information. Growing up around the industry, I was always taught that the infrastructure behind the sport was solid, with rules in place to ensure integrity and protect the animals we love, who cannot speak for themselves, to the best of our ability.

This post focuses on my own locale—Albany.

Recently, the Albany Race Club has been shrouded in gossip, and that gossip seems to be hardening into something that resembles gospel truth. Allegations are swirling that Bayliss has been embezzling money from the club, harassing decent curators, and that Roy Rogers has been inhumanely disposing of animals and even causing trouble up in Broome. If you know, you know.

PeterProfit.com has recently published articles on its WordPress site covering Mark "Money Bags" Bayliss and his questionable money management practices, as well as Roy "King of the Cowboys" Rogers and his alleged practice of "cleansing bronco bloodlines." These articles raise real questions about potential misconduct.

If this is what we’re hearing, what aren’t we hearing about? There are reports of horses needing euthanasia due to organ failure after a grueling 40-hour journey from Broome to Albany, during which the driver stopped only a handful of times—without clear regard for the animals’ wellbeing. The vet who responded to this incident is reportedly the on-course vet in Albany and a subcontractor for RWWA. That individual would not likely cover up such an occurrence, so where is the official statement?

On the financial side, Nicole Bell from RWWA recently visited Albany and seems to have initiated an independent audit of the turf club, which has been in circulation for some time now. Bayliss, after his highly favorable portrayal in the Albany media—I'm looking at you, Albany Advertiser—has gone from being praised as a "hard-nosed footy player" to potentially being exposed as a "misaligned narcissist with a deeply chequered past." With this much smoke, it’s reasonable to suspect there may be fire here. And yet, there has been no action or official statement from the Stewards, RWWA, or the police. Bayliss recently pleaded guilty to a charge as part of a deal on Melbourne Cup day, but it will take time before we know whether Rogers’s Broome activities will face similar scrutiny. For those who don’t know, you’ll likely find out soon enough.

The lack of transparency from RWWA regarding the situation in Albany, especially given everything that has clearly transpired, is astonishing. They seem to be acting as though they are the last to discover how severe things have become, which is bewildering to anyone following these events closely.

I’m no journalist, investigator, or high-profile figure in this environment—just a minority owner and devoted fan of the sport, especially here in WA. But from my inquiry into the Albany situation, it’s clear that far too many RWWA employees have been told to “just remember who pays your salary.”

They should remember—the punters pay theirs.

DamienWyer · November 10

Roy Rogers matter was dealt with by Stewards last week.

Following an investigation and an inquiry conducted on
31 October 2024, Trainer Mr Roy Rogers pleaded guilty to a charge issued
pursuant to Local Rule 313 (3) in that following the euthanasia of four horses
he failed to lodge documentary evidence of compliance with LR 313(3) to the
satisfaction of the Stewards within 7 days. The Stewards, after considering all
matters, including • Mr Roger’s guilty plea, forthright manner and otherwise
good record. • Evidence that he had maintained the care of the horses for a
number of months after their last race starts, and attempts made to re-home or
re-habilitate the horses in question during this period. • The critical
importance to the industry that the traceability of horses is effectively
maintained and regulated as expected by the community and those that support
racing. • That the failure to lodge any required notifications had potential to
compromise the proper regulation of these matters by the Principal Racing
Authority. • The need for the penalty to send a clear message as to the
criticality of lodging notifications once horses are retired from racing,
euthanized or otherwise deceased. It was determined to impose a fine of $5,000
with $1,500 of that suspended for a period of two years

ninjadingo · November 10

That was 4 different horses, not the ones that came back from Broome ...

Frog · November 10

Shocking , would make most sad or cry.

The stewards have lost control and respect in all 3 codes.

Its close to a free for all as they don't what to do anything

that will rock the boat or cause them more work.

As they don't have the money or resources for appeals.

They take the easy and cheapest way every time.

The big guys know this and just take the **** out of the

industry and the little guys take the fines and time.

This is one reason why the 3 codes are down 15/20%

on turnover. Integrity.......

Gilgamesh · November 10

DamienWyer said:
Roy Rogers matter was dealt with by Stewards last week.

Following an investigation and an inquiry conducted on
31 October 2024, Trainer Mr Roy Rogers pleaded guilty to a charge issued
pursuant to Local Rule 313 (3) in that following the euthanasia of four horses
he failed to lodge documentary evidence of compliance with LR 313(3) to the
satisfaction of the Stewards within 7 days. The Stewards, after considering all
matters, including • Mr Roger’s guilty plea, forthright manner and otherwise
good record. • Evidence that he had maintained the care of the horses for a
number of months after their last race starts, and attempts made to re-home or
re-habilitate the horses in question during this period. • The critical
importance to the industry that the traceability of horses is effectively
maintained and regulated as expected by the community and those that support
racing. • That the failure to lodge any required notifications had potential to
compromise the proper regulation of these matters by the Principal Racing
Authority. • The need for the penalty to send a clear message as to the
criticality of lodging notifications once horses are retired from racing,
euthanized or otherwise deceased. It was determined to impose a fine of $5,000
with $1,500 of that suspended for a period of two years

Jesus that punishment does not seem anywhere substantial enough for the charges.

spinking · November 11

Geez Ninja. What a first post keep it coming Dingo as someone once said keep the bastards honest

Muldoon · November 11

spinking said:
Geez Ninja. What a first post keep it coming Dingo as someone once said keep the bastards honest

Hope he has all his ducks in a row, as some stuff in there could have a lawyer salivating if not all correct

I am not implying that anything is, but just saying

ninjadingo · November 11

Muldoon said:

spinking said:
Geez Ninja. What a first post keep it coming Dingo as someone once said keep the bastards honest
Hope he has all his ducks in a row, as some stuff in there could have a lawyer salivating if not all correct

I am not implying that anything is, but just saying

Yeah this really is a valid point. I'm pretty confident that I do have them in a row.

There’s also more out there—lots of whisper going around, which I haven't been able to substantiate. And honestly, if any of it is true, it’s not something I’m about to put my name on or write about and if it turns out to be off base or anyway spurious, that could definitely come back to bite me.

Bottom line, I stand by my post. I trust the research and think the info’s solid - But time will tell.

Edit:Spelling and Grammar

shothru · November 11

DamienWyer said:
Roy Rogers matter was dealt with by Stewards last week.

Following an investigation and an inquiry conducted on
31 October 2024, Trainer Mr Roy Rogers pleaded guilty to a charge issued
pursuant to Local Rule 313 (3) in that following the euthanasia of four horses
he failed to lodge documentary evidence of compliance with LR 313(3) to the
satisfaction of the Stewards within 7 days. The Stewards, after considering all
matters, including • Mr Roger’s guilty plea, forthright manner and otherwise
good record. • Evidence that he had maintained the care of the horses for a
number of months after their last race starts, and attempts made to re-home or
re-habilitate the horses in question during this period. • The critical
importance to the industry that the traceability of horses is effectively
maintained and regulated as expected by the community and those that support
racing. • That the failure to lodge any required notifications had potential to
compromise the proper regulation of these matters by the Principal Racing
Authority. • The need for the penalty to send a clear message as to the
criticality of lodging notifications once horses are retired from racing,
euthanized or otherwise deceased. It was determined to impose a fine of $5,000
with $1,500 of that suspended for a period of two years

cant see any mention of this in the racing wa list of recent enquires ?

Ngawyni · November 11

Rogers is the second WA thoroughbred trainer this year to be fined for failing to lodge paperwork when euthanising horses. Earlier this year another trainer was fined $7000 for an "administrative error" after the euthanasia of 15 horses. It makes all the talk about rehoming initiatives and tracking retired racehorses through a passport system sound hollow. Rogers was quoted in the West today as saying "It's common for trainers to have horses euthanised after retirement. My only rule breach was a failure to lodge paperwork". I really hope it's not that common but given how easy it appears to be, as long as you lodge the paperwork, I suspect Rogers may be right. It's only a matter of time before the anti-racing lobby picks up on this and there's another ABC report.

IMO the rules governing when a retired racehorse can be euthanised (after 6 weeks after attempting to rehome or immediately if 2 other people with knowledge of the horse confirm it exhibits dangerous behaviour) are not strict enough. It shouldn't be the trainer's responsibility. If an owner is not prepared to look after or pay up for a retired racehorse to be looked after until they're rehomed, or at least for a much longer period than 6 weeks (say 12 months during which continuing efforts can be made to rehome them), then they shouldn't be in the game. The horses shouldn't be there just to be used and put down if they're too slow.

There are many ways in which money could be raised up front (the best time to do it is before the horse races) and put into an industry fund to enable every retired racehorse to be agisted at an accredited rehoming facility for at least 12 months post retirement. If the horse was rehomed inside the 12 months, the surplus could accrue in the fund for the benefit of other retired racehorses. If that adds $10k to the cost of owning a racehorse so be it. It costs at least $30k a year to keep a horse in training so a one off $10k should be doable.

The current rules, which if Rogers is right are clearly not working, can be found here:

chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/https://racingwa.com.au/docs/default-source/racing--integrity/updated-equine-retirement-and-euthanasia-rules-effective-1-october-2024.pdf?sfvrsn=dde31e77_1

Gilgamesh · November 11

Ngawyni said:
Rogers is the second WA thoroughbred trainer this year to be fined for failing to lodge paperwork when euthanising horses. Earlier this year another trainer was fined $7000 for an "administrative error" after the euthanasia of 15 horses. It makes all the talk about rehoming initiatives and tracking retired racehorses through a passport system sound hollow. Rogers was quoted in the West today as saying "It's common for trainers to have horses euthanised after retirement. My only rule breach was a failure to lodge paperwork". I really hope it's not that common but given how easy it appears to be, as long as you lodge the paperwork, I suspect Rogers may be right. It's only a matter of time before the anti-racing lobby picks up on this and there's another ABC report.

IMO the rules governing when a retired racehorse can be euthanised (after 6 weeks after attempting to rehome or immediately if 2 other people with knowledge of the horse confirm it exhibits dangerous behaviour) are not strict enough. It shouldn't be the trainer's responsibility. If an owner is not prepared to look after or pay up for a retired racehorse to be looked after until they're rehomed, or at least for a much longer period than 6 weeks (say 12 months during which continuing efforts can be made to rehome them), then they shouldn't be in the game. The horses shouldn't be there just to be used and put down if they're too slow.

There are many ways in which money could be raised up front (the best time to do it is before the horse races) and put into an industry fund to enable every retired racehorse to be agisted at an accredited rehoming facility for at least 12 months post retirement. If the horse was rehomed inside the 12 months, the surplus could accrue in the fund for the benefit of other retired racehorses. If that adds $10k to the cost of owning a racehorse so be it. It costs at least $30k a year to keep a horse in training so a one off $10k should be doable.

The current rules, which if Rogers is right are clearly not working, can be found here:

chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/https://racingwa.com.au/docs/default-source/racing--integrity/updated-equine-retirement-and-euthanasia-rules-effective-1-october-2024.pdf?sfvrsn=dde31e77_1

For me this shows those within the indusrty have no real grasp of how thin the ice is they are skating on.

The notion that oh once a horse cant earn for us it gets the jab is completely unacceptable- at least put it back in RWWA'S hands, surely thst is what the momey they take out is for.

For clarity im not saying all horses are suitable for rehoming or that enough demand exists but trainers can not be so cavalier in their approach.

JimmyPop · November 12

It certainly sounds like RWWA have got no idea.

Muldoon · November 12

Peter Profit with a new article up last night

eFeNCee · November 12

ninjadingo said:
I've been following this forum for a while and really love the community (and the tips). I never had much to post, just enjoyed browsing the chats and taking in the information. Growing up around the industry, I was always taught that the infrastructure behind the sport was solid, with rules in place to ensure integrity and protect the animals we love, who cannot speak for themselves, to the best of our ability.
This post focuses on my own locale—Albany.
Recently, the Albany Race Club has been shrouded in gossip, and that gossip seems to be hardening into something that resembles gospel truth. Allegations are swirling that Bayliss has been embezzling money from the club, harassing decent curators, and that Roy Rogers has been inhumanely disposing of animals and even causing trouble up in Broome. If you know, you know.
PeterProfit.com has recently published articles on its WordPress site covering Mark "Money Bags" Bayliss and his questionable money management practices, as well as Roy "King of the Cowboys" Rogers and his alleged practice of "cleansing bronco bloodlines." These articles raise real questions about potential misconduct.
If this is what we’re hearing, what aren’t we hearing about? There are reports of horses needing euthanasia due to organ failure after a grueling 40-hour journey from Broome to Albany, during which the driver stopped only a handful of times—without clear regard for the animals’ wellbeing. The vet who responded to this incident is reportedly the on-course vet in Albany and a subcontractor for RWWA. That individual would not likely cover up such an occurrence, so where is the official statement?
On the financial side, Nicole Bell from RWWA recently visited Albany and seems to have initiated an independent audit of the turf club, which has been in circulation for some time now. Bayliss, after his highly favorable portrayal in the Albany media—I'm looking at you, Albany Advertiser—has gone from being praised as a "hard-nosed footy player" to potentially being exposed as a "misaligned narcissist with a deeply chequered past." With this much smoke, it’s reasonable to suspect there may be fire here. And yet, there has been no action or official statement from the Stewards, RWWA, or the police. Bayliss recently pleaded guilty to a charge as part of a deal on Melbourne Cup day, but it will take time before we know whether Rogers’s Broome activities will face similar scrutiny. For those who don’t know, you’ll likely find out soon enough.
The lack of transparency from RWWA regarding the situation in Albany, especially given everything that has clearly transpired, is astonishing. They seem to be acting as though they are the last to discover how severe things have become, which is bewildering to anyone following these events closely.
I’m no journalist, investigator, or high-profile figure in this environment—just a minority owner and devoted fan of the sport, especially here in WA. But from my inquiry into the Albany situation, it’s clear that far too many RWWA employees have been told to “just remember who pays your salary.”
They should remember—the punters pay theirs.

Gossip mongers and irritable fleas are many in The Great Southern. Hard working folk with a love for horses and the Industry should not have to carry the burden of those with small minds and big mouths. I’ve known Roy Rogers for 4 decades, he and his staff work tirelessly with the goodwill of horses a priority … he is an asset to The Industry so get off his back.

SLIPPERGOLDEN · November 12

Your first post so obviously associated with Rogers and I doubt the stewards charged him for these offences just because of local gossip and irritable fleas as you describe them.

To quote the stewards...'Rogers otherwise good record'. He had history as a jockey.

Now let me get this right.... Rogers kills 4 healthy but horses too slow for him and he has only done something wrong because he didn't lodge the paperwork. An absolute disgrace and hardly any punishment in the process.

How common in the industry is this treatment of slow and unwanted horses?

Ngawyni · November 12

The thread may have started with a post about Rogers and the Great Southern but there is a much broader issue here about how the industry deals with retired racehorses which RWWA needs to do a better job of addressing, both for the welfare of the horses and to preserve racing's social licence. As Gilgamesh said above there are people within the industry with no real grasp of how thin the ice is they are skating on.

LooksLikeTrouble · November 12

Why not go back to the old system where trainers would assess whether ex gallopers were suitable to become nice hacks and rehomed or put down if they were bad horses that were dangerous and may hurt someone. The system they’ve got now is costing a lot of money. If you drive past the Off The Track / Rehome A Racehorse property in North Dandalup you hardly see a horse. Where’s all the money going?

ninjadingo · November 12

Ngawyni said:

SLIPPERGOLDEN said:
Your first post so obviously associated with Rogers and I doubt the stewards charged him for these offences just because of local gossip and irritable fleas as you describe them.

To quote the stewards...'Rogers otherwise good record'. He had history as a jockey.

Now let me get this right.... Rogers kills 4 healthy but horses too slow for him and he has only done something wrong because he didn't lodge the paperwork. An absolute disgrace and hardly any punishment in the process.

How common in the industry is this treatment of slow and unwanted horses?

My original post was intended to draw attention to the ongoing mismanagement, division, and alarming apathy within RWWA. They are fully aware of what's been happening in Albany, yet they’re doing the bare minimum to address it.

Why was the first Albany meet relocated? Are the people involved truly as problematic as they appear, or am I simply pointing out an inconvenient truth?

It’s genuinely heartbreaking that animal cruelty exists within an industry that claims to hold these animals in such high regard.

My focus isn’t on Roy or Mark as individuals; I’m confident they’ve done enough to prepare their own beds. What worries me is the chaos they’ve left behind—a trail of neglect that Albany is now forced to deal with, neglect that RWWA has enabled.

Ngawyni · November 12

LooksLikeTrouble said:
Why not go back to the old system where trainers would assess whether ex gallopers were suitable to become nice hacks and rehomed or put down if they were bad horses that were dangerous and may hurt someone. The system they’ve got now is costing a lot of money. If you drive past the Off The Track / Rehome A Racehorse property in North Dandalup you hardly see a horse. Where’s all the money going?

The system in place now allows a trainer to decide a horse is too dangerous for rehoming and to immediately put it down. The trainer only needs 2 other people who know the horse to confirm in writing that the horse has exhibited "dangerous behaviour" and then to lodge the paperwork after the horse has been euthanised.

In Rogers' case, the stewards obviously accepted his explanation that the 4 horses he euthanised were unsuitable to be rehomed due to temperament or unsoundness issues. The stewards found that Rogers had attempted to rehome or rehabilitate the horses for a number of months and appear to have been satisfied the only rule breach was Rogers' failure to lodge paperwork.

But, putting Rogers' case aside, the broader problem is:

firstly, under the current rules, there's no requirement for any independent assessment of a horse's behaviour before its able to be put down due to dangerous behaviour, there are no checks and therefore the current system is too easy to abuse and avoid any obligation to attempt to rehome; and

secondly, under the current rules, even horses which are deemed suitable for rehoming can be euthanised after 6 weeks if attempts at rehoming in that time are unsuccessful.

That is nowhere near good enough.

eFeNCee · November 12

Dear "Slipthebootsin", you still don't get it.

First, I said I've known Roy for over 4 decades so it is obvious I have some form of association with him .... nice Detective work. haha !

Secondly, you've taken it upon yourself to either presume or make outlandish statements by writing your own vitriol replacing wording or adding your own version.

Roy was not charged with "offences" as you put it, it was only on ONE charge, that being not submitting the necessary paperwork within the 7 day period as required to do .... which brings me to point 3. Roy did not "kill" any horses, those horses were professionally EUTHANIASED and that was not by his hand.

You further state that those horses "were too slow for him". If you are going to make your own assumptions that is fine but to air your opinion and put it across as fact on a PUBLIC FORUM, to me shows you have an agenda other than making constructive and precise posts.

I am an animal lover, a breeder and an owner of Racehorses. I have recently rehomed a horse after paying up for it for over 6 months. He wasn't a risk to rider or alike, he wasn't going to be a financial burden to his new owner. We try every avenue available to find a suitable home ... yes, even when it costs us 1000's of dollars to do so. I will not stand by and witness anybody, Roy or any other person, be cruel or just dispose of any animal when it is unnecessary.

PS. This is my first post in this forum but only with this identity. When this was a fledgling forum I was an active participant ... never once did I bad mouth an individual and I don't understand those who do. The reason for me not continuing to be active is because I see so much ****, slander and hidden agendas, it pisses me to the max

Rodent · November 12

I've only owned 1 horse and I'm happy to say I paid to float it back from Brisbane to Sydney so he could be given to a local riding school.
That was in the 90s when there were no rules.
He could have been "disposed of" in Brisbane which would've been financially wise but most people love their horses and want to see them looked after.
I'm glad there are rules in place to look after them now. If no home is available, humane euthanasia is sad but necessary I'm afraid.

Flanders · November 13

It is difficult to see how every well-behaved ex racehorse can be re-homed. There are so many horses racing every week across the country... surely there are nowhere close to the same amount of homes for them to go to once they're deemed no good to race.
I'm not making comment on any of the content in this thread- merely pointing out what I see as the unfortunate reality of this sport

GLAMOUR · November 13

I seen a thing on TV over carnival where a lot of good horses go not sure of the name,and there are no doubt other rehoming
places,I think Jamie Kah I think she has taken on past good horses,but as said there must be lots that aren't accounted for.

Buddy123 · November 13

Barker only getting 2 meetings this year n Albany allocated 18 meets..
What’s going on at Barker.. track no good again..

loose_goose · November 14

Buddy123 said:
Barker only getting 2 meetings this year n Albany allocated 18 meets..
What’s going on at Barker.. track no good again..

Barker were advised that they were going to be reduced to two meetings last year, when they lost there last two meetings to Albany. Mt Barker have a fresh new committee & are on track I have heard to have two great meeings (track back to scratch [-( ) & hopefully get some meetings back.

Albany's new President Alan Smith is an old cricket foe from back in the day, and knowing Alan the Club is in good hands to get things back to some normality.

We usually holiday down there over Xmas, so will get to see how things are going first hand at the Boxing Day meeting.

SLIPPERGOLDEN · November 16

eFeNCee said:
Dear "Slipthebootsin",

If you wish to change the name then Sliptheopinionin would be more accurate.

One charge you say and remind me again how many horses? Yes 4

Any dictionary and indeed anyone with intelligence will tell you the term euthanazed means killed. Your capital letters to emphasise euthanazed does not water the method down in any way.

If they weren't killed for being too slow then you as a close associate can be free to let us know why. Owners that wouldn't pay? Insurance ( though snake bites are probably more common). Couldn't find a home for them?

Credit to you for being an animal lover, breeder and owner of racehorses and I certainly understand your loyalty to a person you have known for decades but you must know this is not a good look and is great fodder for the anti horse racing loons.

No hidden agenda from me. I don't know anybody in the Wolfe pack. ;))

Muldoon · November 18

loose_goose said:

Buddy123 said:
Barker only getting 2 meetings this year n Albany allocated 18 meets..
What’s going on at Barker.. track no good again..
Barker were advised that they were going to be reduced to two meetings last year, when they lost there last two meetings to Albany. Mt Barker have a fresh new committee & are on track I have heard to have two great meeings (track back to scratch [-( ) & hopefully get some meetings back.

Albany's new President Alan Smith is an old cricket foe from back in the day, and knowing Alan the Club is in good hands to get things back to some normality.

We usually holiday down there over Xmas, so will get to see how things are going first hand at the Boxing Day meeting.

Just caught up with replays from Saturday, rail was out a bit, but track looked good on vision & still looked ok at the last.

On another matter what was the go with large clods flying around from the turf at Bunbury last Thursday ?

Desperado · November 18

loose_goose said:

Buddy123 said:
Barker only getting 2 meetings this year n Albany allocated 18 meets..
What’s going on at Barker.. track no good again..
Barker were advised that they were going to be reduced to two meetings last year, when they lost there last two meetings to Albany. Mt Barker have a fresh new committee & are on track I have heard to have two great meeings (track back to scratch [-( ) & hopefully get some meetings back.

Albany's new President Alan Smith is an old cricket foe from back in the day, and knowing Alan the Club is in good hands to get things back to some normality.

We usually holiday down there over Xmas, so will get to see how things are going first hand at the Boxing Day meeting.

The club is in good hands with Alan at the helm. Thats great news for the club.

G'day Punter!

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