Thoroughbred – Steward Investigation & Analysis of Wagering Activities Reveals No Impropriety

Mountain · February 2013

McScar on the 7th of July 2012 to me was one of the worst for me, Texan backed off the boards, Knuckey on McScar allows Texan to cross, and then decides to sit back outside of it. Although Texan got beat, it had every chance to win that day. Knuckey hasn't ridden for David Harrison since.

godockers I must have had 50+ conversations with stewards regarding this issue.

Mountain · February 2013

I should clarify that nearly all of my conversations with stewards have been regarding leaders that don't lead, and back-marker's that decide to lead without declaring before hand following betting moves.

To me tempo's of races are imperative and I spend a large portion of my form plotting speed maps and the possible scenarios, as a bookmaker and a punter I feel it's incredibly important to know before hand if any horse intends on changing it's tactics. I feel this is completely fair of me to be annoyed at inconsistencies of an individual horse's racing patterns and to openly complain about it.

It's a fairly basic gripe.

jonesee · February 2013

carey said:

Piston_Broke said:
Rouge Dior race? what question should have been asked ? It worked hard got to the lead the others came off it's back and couldn't catch it
maybe he meant today! =))
chalk and cheese to last time

Desperate not to lead Satdy and runs a stinker...(think he choked it down in his desperation not to lead)... after leading and landing a plunge the start before.
Was there an announcement before the race?

Thumper · February 2013

Thumper said:
Virtual Trader 10/10 4 runners in the race led at their previous starts including Virtual Trader. Virtual Trader is heavily backed and surprise surprise goes straight to the top with none of the other 3 showing any real interest in leading

I'll be looking at race 2 today with interest once the replay is available. Again Virtual Trader is heavily backed and leads in a walk. Thankfully it wasn't good enough.

Nothing in Race 2 yesterday. It was the logical leader and Magnifisio was the only other on speed horse

Thumper · February 2013

Other races of interest

The Corporation 30/06 leds for first time and salutes. Favourite is buried on the fence.

The Regulator 24/11 sits on speed first time in preparation and wins after being supported at long odds. Right Honourable who often leads takes a sit.

Dueton 01/01 heavily backed and led in a walk after never previously leading. The fact that it didn't win and has led since is irrelevant. When questioned rider said nothing else wanted to be there which I assume was how it was meant to happen.

Dash for Home 12/01 Been discussed previously. Frenetic pace set by a donkey. Cunning ploy to put Dasher on board the horse so no questions get asked.

Vermeer 02/02 No speed in the race, Vermeer is supported and it leads for probably the first and last time ever.

Roman Knows 02/02 Been discussed previously. Equal favourite and only danger is restrained to sit near the rear.

Pin Rouge 02/02 Been discussed previosuly. Ringmeister who has only ever won leading is restrinaed to take a sit.

[DeletedUser] · February 2013

Are you a layer of horses Thump ?

Thumper · February 2013

No I'm a Punter

[DeletedUser] · February 2013

You don't lay on betfair ?

RIO · February 2013

wilson said:
Well Rac, put up your races other than Texan. Give us a breakdown of what happened and how. Looking for Perth Races only. As yet nobody has put anything up.
If stewards are looking in the wrong places, where should they look ?
Be specific and let us be the judge.
I want to see an end to all this conjecture. Come on help me here and clear the air.
Or as I said earlier, we can all meet at Ascot and you guys can educate the stewards on where they should be looking.

thumper has provided plenty of races for you to look at wilson...maybe have a look rather than playing the man and what sort of person thumper is or isn't..

he has done as you have asked......now what???

jonesee · February 2013

wilson and other kept asking for examples..in fact begged for examples and i think there have now been given about 25 separate examples in this thread, we probably all vary in which ones we think were curious and which above board BUT...the need to investigate every single race from NOW ON where heavily backed leaders get soft runs is DESPERATE...

RIO · February 2013

so correct jonesee...even if there was nothing wrong with every one of the examples put forward, there is definitely a need for questions to be raised and investigations to be had - at the time - in the majority of them.. And we have had nothing and we have just had a major investigation and the Blind Freddies have seen nothing...and a lot of us feel it's due to them not looking at races in the correct manner to see the problems.

When a steward that your talking to says...they(being his colleagues) cant agree whether a horse is moving in and causing interference or the other horse is moving out and causing interference - how in the world do you think they can read the pace of a race!!! You know that they are not seeing what we see.

Thumper · February 2013

wilson said:
You don't lay on betfair ?

No I don't even have a betfair account.

godockers · February 2013

Super Snoop said:
you think its just one bookmaker with a gripe godockers? might be time to take your head out of the sand. the goings on have been frequently discussed by the heads of industry at the Thoroughbred racing consultative group for months now.
it is of major concern to RWWA even though the stewards failed to recognise anything strange.
funnily enough, it took the victorian stewards to find anything strange at durrants stables too.

godockers · February 2013

I dont think it is one bookmaker with a gripe at all , I used Ian Lenton as an example because his name was bought up in an earlier answer , Ian does tweet and make his opinions quite clear, nothing wrong with that but as a licensed person put forward your case officially , stop stirring the pot unofficially.I am sure its way more than one bookmaker whinging (as they do when they lose) its just lucky now they bet so ridiculously small( except for Peter Bartlett ) that no matter how many rorts they think there are they cant lose much money!!

[DeletedUser] · February 2013

Thankyou Thumper, I was just asking the question as I had a theory which your answer dispells.
I was not playing the man at all.
I leave that to others Rio. I still have your abusive and rude PM's that you send me Rio.
Thumper I had a big day at the races yesterday and I haven't had chance to look at the races you have put up.
Thankyou for being the only one who has put something up with you take on it as well.

Fastmoney · February 2013

wilson said:
Thankyou Thumper, I was just asking the question as I had a theory which your answer dispells.
I was not playing the man at all.
I leave that to others Rio. I still have your abusive and rude PM's that you send me Rio.
Thumper I had a big day at the races yesterday and I haven't had chance to look at the races you have put up.
Thankyou for being the only one who has put something up with you take on it as well.

Can`t you have a look yourself Wilson.

Everyone of Thumpers examples have been discussed on this forum before.

It not that hard to find them.

wilson said:
Are you a layer of horses Thump ?

wilson said:
You don't lay on betfair ?

Whats the relevance of these 2 questions?

[DeletedUser] · February 2013

I will answer Thumper on that FM. He has at least put something up.

Fastmoney · February 2013

So its a 2 way conversation now not a forum?

RIO · February 2013

wilson said:
I was not playing the man at all.
I leave that to others Rio. I still have your abusive and rude PM's that you send me Rio.

glad you kept them..personal attacks and playing the man rather than the issue is what iam all about.. 8-} ...got a feeling PM, means Personal Message....I just didn't realise you were so sensitive and as soon as i did i stopped...

darkshines · February 2013

Said it earlier, the apologist movement might need to elect a new representative, one who can offer something a bit more advanced than kindy sandpit tactics.

Fastmoney, who won't you put something up? At least Thumper put something up - no one else has had the balls to do that over the past year. FM, put somethign up. :-@

Fastmoney · February 2013

.

Fastmoney · February 2013

http://www.perthturftalk.com.au/discussion/discussion/13394/does-race-5-at-belmont-have-a-smell-about-way-it-was-run#Item_53

http://www.perthturftalk.com.au/discussion/discussion/15060/boat-race-we-just-saw#Item_129

http://www.perthturftalk.com.au/discussion/discussion/12590/curious-and-questionable-rides-and-performances-#Item_81

Not that hard to find.

darkshines · February 2013

Maybe have a re-read over that post, and my others on this thread mate . . .

Thumper · February 2013

Would be remiss of me not to mention Texan 23/06. Texan is backed from $4.20 to $2.80. Solsay leads as expected but sets only a leisurely tempo despite having won it's last 3 in much quicker times by rolling along. I'm sure this one has also been mentioned before but Fatsmoney give me some credit, I think I have bought up a few new ones.

Fastmoney · February 2013

Apologies DS missed the tone of your post.

Thumper · February 2013

"I saw many wise heads state this fact in the racing conference held this week. Wonder how many WA stakeholders (even stewards) attended . . . ."

Anybody know when the minutes held of the last TRCG meeting will be available online. Will be an intersting read no doubt.

Fastmoney · February 2013

Wilson?????

RIO · March 2013

so is there any feedback from any of the doubters about the races in question???

I mean there was a big song and dance about putting up or shutting up and it appears that as soon as someone puts something up the people making those statements shut up?????

Just wondering if I misinterpreted the question???? Does put up or shut up, actually meaning..... You put up and I’ll shut up???? Cos that really does appear to be what has happened here....hhmmm, a few people when confronted on this site seem to be more like pussy cats than robust tigers..

But of course i'm not the type of persoon to name names...Not my way of doing things..
:D

Fastmoney · March 2013

You didn`t really expect an educated response did you Rio?

RIO · March 2013

I didn't expect to get a logical assessment of the races in question, but after all the trouble that a few went to re-post old information I actually did expect a response..not sure I would have classified it as an educated response. Although due to the lack of response I can’t actually formulate an opinion of the response.

I have to say that since we highlighted many incidents on here late last year...and since the blind freddies started shaking trees and asking punters placing large bets in TAB's questions...the past few months have not had a massive amount of obvious anomalies....

Oh and it is also interesting that those who objected to us questioning all these races have mysteriously gone very quiet as well..

I am certain it is only a coincidence...but an interesting one in my opinion....

I thouhght a month was long enough for the nasayers to assess the races and post a response..Maybe they need longer????

G'day Punter!

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